Í þessum þætti talaði ég við Leslie Dixon sem kennir handverk og trefsmíðar við endurhefingarmiðstöð fyrir fyrfirandi hermenn í bandaríkjónum.Viðtalið er á ennsku og í lok þáttarins ákvaði ég að leifa að fljóta með smá spjalli milli okkar sem að mér fannst ekki alveg passa inn í viðtalið en er engu að síður áhugavert.Það er það að það er það að það er.Hvað er það að það er og hvað er það að það er?Það er það að það er.Það er það að það er.Það er það að það er.Það er það að það er.Það er það að það er.Það er það að það er.Það er það að það er.Það er það að það er.Það er það að það er.Það er það að það er.Það er það að það er.Það er það að það er.Það er það að það er.Það er það að það er.Það er það að það er.Það er það að það er.Það er það að það er.Það er það að það er.Það er það að það er.Það er það að það er.Það er það að það er.we make sure that this is actually safe?So the first thing I do is I have the veteran checkfor anything on the table.Before we even raise the blade,I want to make sure that they've checked the table,made sure there's no pieces of scrap laying up there,no tools laying up there.We want to make sure that whole surface is clearand free of anything that could come flying back at usonce we turn the saw on.I'm going to show the veteran how to use the guard over the bladeand let them experience how that guard goes up and downas you're pushing the wood through.I'm going to show them landmarks on the machine.Our particular table saw on top of the fencehas words written across the top in raised letters.So I've discovered thatif I have a table saw on top of the fence,I'm sliding my fingers along the fence.When I get to that first raised letter,that's as close as I want my hand to the blade at that point.So that is a tactile landmark that I can show them.We'll practice pushing a piece of wood through the machinebefore we even raise the blade.So we'll just have them practice going through the motions,learning that when the board gets to the edge of the tableon the back end as you're starting to push it through,how to switch over to a push stick,how to listen to the machine and the noises that it makeswhen you push the wood through.So when that blade is spinning, it makes a certain sound.But once I start pushing a piece of wood through it,the sound is going to change.How does that sound change?What can you expect to hear?And then I show them where they can safely put their hands,what to look for if they're moving their hands,around to know where they are in relationship to that blade at all times.And then, you know, unless you're pushing a large piece of wood through,you always want to use a push stick with a table saw.Some people would say you want to use a push stick at all times.I think there are certainly times where it's just not as feasible to use a push stick.And, you know, we'll go through each step of that.We'll go through each step of that processand make them comfortable with it before they ever turn the blade on.With some veterans, I'll even demonstrate a cut before they take over.And so I will, as I'm cutting a piece of wood,I will talk them through every step of where I'm putting my hands,what I'm doing at each phase of pushing that board through.And then how to feel at the end of that cut,once I turn the machine off,how to put my hands on the edge of the table,to feel the vibration so that I know when all the vibration in that table stops,then I can give it, you know, I should give it to the count of five.And then I know it is safe to reach out toward the bladeto retrieve the piece of wood that I've just cutbecause I know all movement in that table has stopped at that time.I know that I will never forget the wind from that table.I know that I will never forget the table saw blade from the first time.Yes, it does split off a breeze.I cut something on a table saw at LCB.That was quite an experience, I think.Mm-hmm.But why would you have a wood shop at a rehabilitation center?Why is it important?Why?Why don't you just stick with,you know, the traditional way of doing things?Well, we want people to know thatblindness doesn't mean that they have to stop doing what they love.In most cases, you know, their biggest restriction is going to be driving.They're not going to be able to drive anymore,but we can show them in other ways that their life doesn't have to be over.They don't have to spend the rest of their life sitting on the couchor sitting in an easy chair,having people take over their life.They don't have to take care of them.They can get out and do the things they want to do.And so one of the things that the wood shop builds,even for people who aren't going to go home and do woodworking,that can build a lot of confidence for them to know that if I can do this,I can do anything.If I can cut this piece of wood or I can build this birdhouse,then I really can do anything I want to do.So do you think it has to do with the fact that most people would probably think,I think that it's not possible to do woodworking as a blind personwhen in fact, when you look at it,if you take all the, like if you move all the safety considerations away,it's a quite tactile field.I think it's a big step towards saying, you know,if I can do this, I can go outside and I have the confidence,I have the confidence to go outside and cross the street safelyor do other things safely.It's also a big lesson in paying attention and organization.So monitoring your steps, doing your checklist of safety to know,okay, if I turn this machine on, is everything in placeto make what I'm about to do safe?Really emphasize focusing on paying close attentionto what you're doing and what you're not doing.Because every person that's walked through my doorwith missing fingers, fortunately to my knowledge,no one has ever lost fingers after they left my program.They tell me all the time that they lost those fingersbecause they were in a hurry or they weren't paying attentionor they're thinking about something else.It's always some version of the same reason.And so,you know, now we really want to focus on breaking down those stepsand doing that checklist of safety and making surethat we're following every step, taking our time.That's what I've heard too, because I'm right now going through a phaseand I think my time at LCB actually made this possible for me.I'm renovating a house and I don't have a lot of money available.So I,I have been trying to just figure out how to do certain things.And having that experience from the, from the woodshop at LCB,I think has enabled me to, to know that, yes, you can,if you follow safety guidelines, if you do certain things,if you adapt certain things, for example, I've been using a caulking gun for to glue some,pieces of flooring up to a, to my, my kitchen interior to close,close an open, open corner.And like the only thing that, the only thing, like I've, I've never even tried before,but the only thing that I have to do to be able to do this pretty effectively,it's just to wear like a, a dish washing glove, like a latex glove on one hand.And I just do that.I, I apply,the, the, the glue with a, with a gun and I throw the glove away.And it's, it's, it's just a really simple solution to something that could be,be very easy to say, like, how are you going to do that?How, like, how on earth are you going to be able to do that?Since you can't see, like, how the, how the gun is behaving, how the glue is behaving.Right.And I, I've had to work with veterans.Right. And I, I've had to work with veterans.I, I just had a gentleman recently who was very much in denial about blindness and what could be done.And so he just kept saying, well, I don't know how to do this.I can't do this.I can't see.I can't do this because I can't see.And so we had to break it down.And, and all he was doing was applying stain to a piece of wood.Well, we break it down.Okay.How do you know if you've got stain on the rag?How can you tell if the rag's got stain on it?And so we had to talk.We had to talk through all the ways that you might be able to determine that you've got stain on this rag.And then how can you tell if you've put stain on the wood?How can you tell if you've got the wood completely covered in stain?How can you tell which pieces you've already done and which pieces you can't?We may have to break it down that far or we may have to break it down even further.And so maybe in one class we, we only get through a small portion of the task.Because we really want to encourage people to start thinking differently, problem solving, even if the idea sounds crazy, just go ahead and throw it out there because it may bring you to a solution at some point.And so just teaching them to think outside the box, get creative with their processes and really developing those problem solving skills so that they can, if it's something they've never done before, maybe they can figure out a way to do it.And I think there's something to be said for creativity because working with your hands, I think, is a bit different from doing something else like playing an instrument.I mean, you could, you could say probably that you're also working with your hands, but if you've decided, like if you have a piece of wood and you need to drill six holes in it, like at certain places.Mm-hmm.Once you know how to do that, that kind of becomes automatic and you can, what I'm trying to say, like it's almost creativity in action.Like you're, you're, you're acting out what you've been thinking about and that, at least for me, sort of like relaxes my mind and sort of invites more.I don't know if I'm making sense at all.Mm-hmm.I think it encourages, you know, like you said, creativity and there can be, it's like solving a puzzle.So there can be joy in, just in that process of figuring out, okay, if I need to mark six holes that are a half inch apart and follow a straight line, what, what do I have at my disposal to be able to do that?Mm-hmm.How am I going to find, you know, just asking questions about each step of the process, how am I going to make a straight line that I can feel?How am I going to mark those holes so that I can find them later?How am I going to keep my drill straight if I'm using a hand drill?How am I going to keep that drill straight so that my holes aren't being drilled at an angle and they're coming out straight through the other side?Or maybe, how am I going to drill?How am I going to drill those holes where they don't go all the way through?They only go a half inch down.What do I have at my disposal that I can use to do that with?And it's like, can often be like learning to walk again.So if, if I have a student who's been a woodworker for a long time, they, they haven't forgotten how to be a woodworker.What they need to learn now is how to find different ways of doing things and they need to do that at a pace.Where they can take the time to think each step through, think about how they're going to maintain safety and then implement that step before they start thinking about what, what are they going to do 10 steps down the road in this project?Because that's where you get hurt when you're, when you're thinking, you're not thinking about what's in front of you, you're thinking about the future.And so, you know, I tell them,Maybe your job takes twice as long, maybe it takes four times as long for you to do something that you used to be able to do very quickly, but you're building that muscle memory again.And so we're taking the time to go through each thing slowly and build up new muscle memory so that we can increase our speed down the line.So I always encourage my students to, they're going to go home and make a project.Let's say they have a deadline, a birthday or a Christmas present.Give yourself plenty of time to accomplish this.You got something that you're going to make for a Christmas present in December.Maybe start it in, in the summer or, you know, September or October at the earliest so that you have more than enough time to get the project done and take your time with it and do it right.Because if you're trying to do it the weekend before Christmas.You run the risk of getting hurt because you're in a hurry at this point and either you get hurt or you, you don't do it correctly.And it, it turns out to be something you didn't really want or not as good as you wanted it to be.And, and unfortunately we see a lot of people who, who want to do it right the first time and that may not happen, but that just means we practice more.I love to tell people when they come in and they're,they're amazed at what I can do, especially, let's say for instance, in cutting leather, you know, when I first started cutting leather, it, it looked like I chewed it apart with my teeth.It was so ragged and ugly, but in the last seven years, I've gotten very good at cutting leather and I can cut a nice straight line now where I couldn't do that before.And that, that was practice.That was learning which tools work best for me.I am not great with scissors.I am not great.With a rotary cutter, but you give me an exacto blade, which is like a scalpel almost.It's, it's a pencil grip handle with a small blade and a straight edge and I've got it.I can cut anything with that, but it took time for me to find all that out.And it took time for me to practice those skills enough where I got pretty good at it.So, but why, like, I'm a little bit interested in why.What, what was it that drew you into crafting these kinds of like manual skills, as you say, like, how, how did you get pushed towards that line of work?This is something I've always loved.When I was a kid, I loved to draw.I was, I was the one, so I, I just have one brother, but I was the one.When my dad was a kid.When my dad was a kid.When my dad was a kid.When my dad was fixing something around the house, I was the one standing next to him going, what are you doing?Show me how to do that.Can you teach me how to do that?That was just something I was always interested in.And so when I got older and I went to college, I discovered, kind of in a roundabout way, I discovered industrial design.And I discovered that because I was helping.I was helping a friend who was going to school and was struggling to learn the technology that she had been given to assist her in school.So screen reader, adaptive recording devices.She was really having a hard time with that.And I thought, well, I could go to school and I could work with blind people on learning skills that will help them.I just kind of have a little bit of a knack for some of that, especially for problems.Solving and figuring things out.And so I started looking into what I would need to do, what degree I would need to go in.And industrial design was one of my options.And so I went in that and I really excelled at building models and project management.And I discovered pretty quickly the things that I couldn't do, the things I could do, and the things that I was really good at.What is that?Just really quickly, what is industrial design?Industrial design?So industrial design is essentially product designs.Anything that you have that was made by man was designed.It was designed to fit for as many people as possible.So it was, let's say, a piece of furniture.It's got to accommodate someone who is, you know, three foot tall.As well as somebody who's...Six and a half feet tall.So how do you make a product that will be comfortable for the widest range of people possible?And in design, it's usually...Designers usually focus on the parts of products that people interact with.So how does it look?How does it feel?Is it something when you hold it in your hand, does it feel comfortable?Where engineers are focused on primarily on the function of a device.And so often you will have either designers who work with as engineers.Sometimes you'll have engineers who work as designers.And sometimes you'll have both designers and engineers who work together to create a projectthat is appealing to people as well as functional for as many different body types and sizes as possible.Very interesting.Yes.It was a...It was a very interesting experience to go through thatbecause once we were through basic design,we spent three years working with companies.So we would go to a class that was sponsored by a companyand we would...Our entire focus of that class was to design a project for that companyor a product for that company.And so we learned every step of the process.We learned the steps of designing something from the front end.Where you have to go out and you have to do market researchand talk to people and look at existing products that do the same thing.You have to then start coming up with concept ideasand figuring out what works and what doesn't.And then, you know, we've started in all kinds of different points along the path.Or we had a company that said, here's what we want to do.We're already past the development stage.We just need...We just need a design that's going to work and going to sell.And so then we've got to really focus more on the concepts and modelsand making something for that company.And so we got a lot of experience working for different companies.A lot of experience presenting to that company.Putting together a presentation and trying to sell the product you designed to that company.And say, you know, choose...This is...This is my pitch for you to choose my design.And so we got...We got every aspect of the job.And it was...It was a lot of fun, a lot of hard work.But it was a great experience.And one where I was the first visually impaired person in the program.And so we had to do a lot of problem solving and a lot of adaptations.Especially in the three years I was in the program,my vision was steadily getting worse.So we had to not only...We had to not only adapt the program for my needs from the beginning,we had to continue to adapt the program to my needsthroughout my time in school because of my changes in my vision.And that might have meant modifying my assignments or picking,you know, if we were going to have 50 assignments due,picking 20 assignments that still embodied all the lessons I needed to learn,but weren't there.But weren't as many assignments as the other class members had to dobecause it was taking me more time.Or, you know, they even helped create tools for me,which is a great thing about being in a college programwhere we had a fully functional wood shop and metal shop.They could design modified tools for me to be able to do my classwork with.And that was also a great experience in just modifying thingsfor somebody with a disability,which is the field I was going into anyway.So it kind of worked out to be an extra learning experience for meto see how my teachers worked through the process of designing a modified tool.So we've touched on you, yourself.We've touched on woodworking as a blind person and safety considerationsand why maybe it is,indeed, a good idea for these kinds of skillsto be a part of rehabilitation.I think maybe it doesn't have to be necessarily woodworking,but it could be anything really that makes you realizethat things that you thought weren't possible are indeed very possible.Mm-hmm.But is there anything that you would like to say at the end that you thinkI would want to hear for my podcast?For your podcast that you think you would want to hear?I think just, you know,once you start that journey of problem solvingand trying to figure out what you need to do a task,you know, finding resources that help you,whether it's YouTube videos where, you know,a person does a great job at describing their process of making something.So I try to look for woodworking videoswhere the person does a good job at describing what they're doingor other craft videos for that same reason.Or I might, you know, find a resource of, you know,similar people, find a community,like the woodworking for the blind group or the blind handyman groups.You know, that's a good resource of people who have, you know,that's a good resource of people who have, you know, that's a good resource of people who have,you know, that's a good resource of people who have, you know,a wealth of experience who like to share that and help others.So just getting all those, all your resources and as many as you can.Or even finding people who are near you,who can work with you on things or who are like-mindedand can watch a video.I will sometimes send a video to someone that I knowwho could explain it and say,hey, I'm trying to figure out what they're doingin this video when they cut this piece of wood can you can you explain that to me and knowingknowing when to ask for visual help there's there's gonna be times where you just need to getsomeone who can look at your work and knowing how to ask questions that will get you the mostinformation i tell my my veterans the worst question you can ask is how does this lookbecause people are going to tell you what you want to hear oh it looks great they may be flawsthat they think are supposed to be there so asking leading questions that are going to get you theright answers i'm trying to stain this belt black can you take a look at it and let me know if thereare any areas that are still showing the tan background or did i miss any areas completelyjust things like that knowing knowing when to getvisual assistance and knowing how to how to utilize that in a way that's going to get youthe most information using all your tools okay so i don't think i have any more questions sojust thank you very much for finding the time to do this this interview yeah thank you for having mebyeyoujust thank you very much for finding the time to do this this interview yeah thank you for having medodoSoSaved recordingIt's keptYou're right, that woodworkingFor the blind groupIs reallyLooks like there's some people thereWith a lot of knowledgeWe haveDennis who isIn his 80sAnd knowsHas probably forgotten moreAbout woodworking than most people knowWe have AndrewWho wasI believe he was a directorA project manager for Habitat for HumanitySo he knows tons about constructionAnd we have GeorgeWho is aA wood artistSo heHe boughtAn oldIt was an old laundryFrom the 1800sIn this small town in TennesseeAndHe spent yearsMaking it intoA home and a businessSo he hasThree storiesHe hasA hugeWood shopDownstairs in the basementHe hasHe has builtA two-story living areaIn the top partAnd he did all theThe work himselfAnd he has a storefrontWhere he makesHe makesBottle stoppersAndBiscuit cuttersAnd all kinds ofLittle artisticHe makes bowlsAnd plattersAnd all these thingsThat he sellsIn hisIn his storefrontAndHe did all of that workAnd he does contract workFor other peopleSo he'sHe'll go out andBuild a barAt a restaurantOr he'llI don't know what it was forBut he built a giantI think seven footRound doorFor someone who was makingA house to look likeLike a hobbit houseAnd he's well knownAnd he'sHe goes to trade showsAnd he teachesWoodturning classesAndHe's made all of that workFor himAnd so we haveJust with himAnd DennisAnd AndrewAnd other peopleWe have tons of experienceOn there
